E07: You're Lazy and You Know It with Ken Cook

Jim: What is up, Remote Start Nation! Let's get something started. I'm Jim Doyon and welcome to another episode of Remote Start, where I bring you stories and strategies on how to start a business, build a brand and create your desired lifestyle.

Today, we're going to be covering starting small systems and scaling laziness and procrastination, not your perspective and last but not least, ethical profits. To share these and drop a ton of value for you, I have brought on a very good friend of mine, Ken Cook also known as Cookie. Cookie and I met years ago at a tattoo convention and from the minute I met him it was one of those people that you meet, you see, and you're like that dude and I are so well, like on the same level, I got to talk to him or we're both in the tattoo industry together, I knew that before even meeting him that I was someone at everybody was like dude you guys are like, you need to talk to him, you talk businesses the same, you have the same thoughts, like, you needed me Cookie. Little did I know that I was going to be blown away by how awesome this dude was and years later, we're still great friends and the thing that's kept us together more than a lot of things is the fact that we both have this huge connection for entrepreneurship and business and so this is an extreme honor to bring him on today to share with you and help us to all grow from what he's done in his career. Cookie is a serial entrepreneur he is co-owner and managing partner of Rebel Muse  Tattoo Studios with four locations across the country and more in the works. Today, Cookie is going to be dropping knowledge and shooting a straight with no bullshit on how he's grown to the success in his business, that he has, so, without further ado Cookie, welcome to the Remote Start Nation.

Cookie: Jim, it's good to see you, brother.

Jim: Good to see you too, man. I'm so stoked that you're here flew in from Salt Lake today?

Cookie: Yeah, yeah Flowing from Salt lake, like I had a little thing going on up there with a company that I, but I'm involved in called Bad Dog Gang, yeah, flew in from Salt Lake, but man, it's been so long it's great to see you.

Jim: It's awesome, and I'm truly honored that you flew here to be on the podcast and spend some time with me before you fly out back home tomorrow, so, thank you from the bottom of my heart, oh, man, I'm stoked.

Cookie: I appreciate it brother.

Jim: So, let's get this started, man.

Cookie: Let's do it.

Jim: I want you to tell the Remote Nation, Remote Start Nation, tell, tell them where you're from, tell me your background, what you're doing now and, and more importantly, tell them, I want to know that one moment in your life when you were like, I need to start my own business, I need to do this on my own.

Cookie: All right, all right, let's go, so guys and girls, you can probably hear, I've got a bit of an accent.

Jim: So I'll figure that out.

Cookie: Born and raised in Perth, Western Australia, I'm a high school dropout, I left school at 15 years old, I hated school, I love the social aspect, I'm a social guy and I think Jim can vouch for that, you know, we're both pretty social people.

Jim: That's why we hit it off.

Cookie: I think so, I love people, I love getting to know people, I love like the comedy that you know, comes with hanging out with people and that, you know, the funny shit that happens. So, you know, I'm in high school, I hate the education aspect of it, but I love my friends, you know, I love, you know, chasing girls and just, you know, being a young kid growing up in Western Australia, I was racing motocross at the time and just, you know, living my living my best life as a little West, Ozzy whippersnapper, you know, but I'm getting into more and more trouble in school, um, so I reach about fifteen, fifteen and a half years old and you know, I tell my mom at the time, I don't want to go to school anymore and she comes back with you don't have to and I am like that, okay, sweet deal, so I'm like, you know, okay home free and then she hits me with the butt, oh my gosh, it there's a, but she's like, but if you're not going to go to school, you need a full-time joband I'm sure like, you know, stuff chant rules have changed, I'm 30 38 years old right now, so this is a while ago, but back then, I was, I was able to leave and get a full-time job so I start looking for work and honestly, like work didn't appeal to me till later in my adult life, like I was almost kind of bitter, you know, I would see people like, you know, rich kids and stuff with and I felt that their life was easy, and I wanted that and I didn't have that and so to do what I had to do to pursue my dreams and to even just live the lifestyle that I wanted to live on a day-to-day basis I did have to go to work, so I've looked for jobs, I didn't really find anything that really I was all about, but I'd but I did find a program at a tech school to be a mechanic, so I signed up for that, it was a six month course and after that you are not guaranteed, but it was unlikely that you weren't going to get an apprenticeship, so, I signed up for this course to get there I had to take a bus to trains and another bus so, Would leave home at 4:30 every morning, I would get there by, you know, I want to say like call today, the class starts at a time, get there by 7:45 and then I would take a bus to trains and another bus to get home. Did that for six month, six months scored an apprenticeship at a BMW dealership and I'm naturally good at fixing cars and working on cars and bikes and stuff like that, but I've never actually liked it, so I did this job for a 5-6 years and I Then I love the social aspect, I would fuck around half the day, but I hated it. I got sent over East for training and you know, it's the best scenario that like a young kid could have starting out in the workforce and the pay wasn't terrible but it just, it wasn't me, you know, just because you're really good at something it doesn't mean that you're going to love it.

 Jim: So true.

Cookie: So basically, you know, for all this time, I'm racing dirt bikes and I'm like, man, I wish I was fast enough to do this for a living kind of thing. I was following the American scene. I loved what I saw in America I just loved everything, the bikes, the cars, just it just seemed like a magical place to me and so, I stuff didn't work out being a mechanic, I just started getting into too much trouble at work and it was kind of a thing where they're like, hey, dude, you can leave or we're going to force you to leave because you're a fuckup.

Jim: Like hell?

Cookie: Yeah, so I was like cool, I'll go, so I kind of got more in a construction and I enjoyed that because I like being outside and, you know, we could mess around mall with buddies and stuff, but it still wasn't me so long story short, you know, I come to the states with a buddy, we go on, like this traveling holiday for like a year we'd saved up like, you know, I think we saved that like, 50 Grand each and we're ready to just come over to the states and party we did some writing, we followed the motocross around, you know, we'd go to Vegas, we got to Canada.

Jim: How long were you here for?

Cookie: So I was here almost a year. And it was just a party, it was crazy, you know.

Jim: Doesn't sound like going to enjoy that at all.

Cookie: No, no, that's not, that's not us at all, right?Yeah, Jim forces to bring a bottle of Jameson in the studio to record this today, which, you know, I wasn't against but you know, that was a good year of my life and if anything that's said in stone where I wanted to be in the futureI loved it over here, I love this country and I didn't want to leave. So when I finally got to come back, you know whether with a US Visa, I was working in a tattoo shop and I saw the flaws, I worked in, I want to say two or three tattoo shops and I saw the floors, I saw how it was run bad, how owners didn't give a shit about their people or their clients or anything, and I felt like I could do it better and I guess that was my turning point where I was like, I'm going to, this is what we're going to do we're going to, we're going to tattoo and we're going to learn how to do this, we're going to open shops and this is what we're going to do.

Jim: That's an awesome journey to get here, man, and you know, now to get where you are like, you've got four studios, you guys are planning a launch more, you're planning on launching other areas in the tattooing world and you're continuously growing your brand's that you're part of, we didn't start there, right? You start you started small and so, you know, you're working for someone else, you understand what you need to do to get that to that next level, you understand that you are going to leave and start your own thing. What do you do there?

Cookie: Well, it's kind of funny because what I did I implemented what I wanted to do in somebody else's business and honestly really without their permission it was beneficial for sure,  yeah, but I was so ready to like, jump in and give it a try that, I just started doing stuff in their business that I felt would be beneficial and would attract more clients and be better for artists and that's kind of how I like, you know, dipped a toe in the water.

Jim: And you're very business minded in the fact that you really believe in systems and processes and in coming up with a foundation and scaling it from there. So was starting small and you know, talk to me about your first studio, and opening that up and what that was like.

Cookie: Yeah, yeah, that, that was actually a really fun time because you know, we won't, we won't broke, but we didn't have money, you know, and we had to be very careful of what we took on as far as overheads so you know, my wife and I and our business partners, we kind of found a spot that that work for us financially, it wasn't anything impressive, you know, it was something that we knew, if we didn't have any artist, you know, any, any employees, any contractors, anything like that, we can handle it on our own.

Jim: And at this point, is it just the four of you tattooing? Because you were also tattooing.

Cookie: Yeah, yeah, so I did tattoo back in the day and I still tattoo from time to time now, it's just rare, you know, it's like close friends and stuff, I love tattooing, but I've I honestly feel like these days you have to be so, art driven and passionate about it because the competition is so fierce and my true passion is business, not tattooing.

Jim: And you've obviously shown that with what you've built over the years and obviously you have partners, so when you first started and knowing that you were going to open up your own location and shop, and did you think from the start like hey, I'm going to Liz and I my wife, we're going to get partners, we're going to find partners, like, how did that work with you and your partner?

Jim: Yeah, actually we did think that and, his the thing with that, you know, Liz and I at the time would traveling so much, so half of our year was spent overseas doing like tattoo conventions and stuff like that, so we really felt that if we were going to kick this off and here's the thing that I want to, back then I was scared to jump all in, I was, I was always looking for a safety net, I don't do that anymore, you know, but back then, I did want to safety net, and for me at the time that safety net was having a business partner, that could help look after the studio that we're away and a situation that would be beneficial for both parties, so, you know, my business partnerDave, he had young boys at the time he needed to be right there in Dallas with something stable and steady, and we needed the opportunity to travel so we had two different needs, but we both needed the same thing at the same time.

Jim: You know and now looking at it and where you've grown, do you think you could do it by yourself or do you, do you know, in your heart that you could not be where you're at today with the Rebel Muse Studio without the four of you?

Cookie: Yeah, 100%, well, we got today would not happen without the four of us.

Jim: That's incredible.

Cookie: It is, because, and a lot of people ask me this question, like, oh, what's it like having business partners that must suck? Yes it does at times, you know, four people don't think the same right, but it's Crucial to our success and it's a business partnership is like a marriage, you know, it can be great or it can be a absolute disaster, but either way you've got to put work into it. I feel like the direction that we've gone four of us, bring old, you know, different attributes to the table.

Jim: Now, did you set up in the beginning or have you now set up to say, like okay cookie my role as this, this, this is what I'm going to do, business partner number two, this is what you're going to do,business partner number three, this is what you're going to do, like, how did that work out?

Cookie: Yeah, that was a crazy evolution because it wasn't always like that, and I feel like it's so easy to look back now and be like, oh, what will we thinking, and but back in the day, we owed his tried to do everything and that doesn't work, you know.

Jim: Yeah, it's you have to have those define lines, and it's okay and I say this from, you know, Remote Start Nation for those of you that don't know, I still have a business partner in Woodward movement with Nathan, who we've been together since the start of ink addict and we started the same way cookie, it was, like we both jump in but he was always like, Nathan understands brands he loves brands, he is like the go-to for brands and ink attic was his brainchild, so it was always hey when you, when it comes to a decision that is the final decision for ink addict that's on you, like I want you to make that decision and so we had that definitive that fine line, but there was always a little bit of blurred vision right, like where we knew it, we could we could we could jump in together, but when it came to it if he spoke his mind on something I was backing off and on the business side of it and some of the marketing some of the other, the things that we did it was it was the complete opposite, he would let me have those decisions and that I think makes a true partnership work and the ones that don't I think are the ones that stay together for a long period of time without understanding what that clear expectation of each other is, and it sounds like you guys have found that out now.

Cookie: Yeah, it takes work, you know, you've really got to play on your strengths and like I said, in the beginning, we all did a bit of everything and when you break that down and it doesn't make sense, you know, like my I'm good with people. I feel like I understand people and I love people getting to know people and helping people, a lot of like artists brains don't work like that artists can be very reclusive and very focused, you know, and not really people, people, it a lot of artists are very introverted.

Jim: And between the four of you I think that's why you do so, well is your also diverse in your own ways.

Cookie: Definitely.

Jim: So you started small start with one shop, you had to do something to get to where you are now and you know, I know you are a systems person. Talk about that for a minute, like how did you what systems did you use, what did you implement to get to where you are or from where you were to where you are now?

Cookie: Yeah totally. So at first video, it wasn't anything super impressive. We started off with 1,200 square feet and then we pretty quickly doubled the size of that in the same location and honestly, we would kind of flying by the seat of our pants, you know, we were pretty young at the time, our studio, like I said, it wasn't anything impressive, we'd finish it out, nice, but it was very much so on a budget and so, we're our systems, we didn't put money into the systems,  so my business partner is so I have three business partners, one is my wife Liz and the other two are a married couple as well David and Ellen, David is an incredible tattoo artist and Ellen is an incredible business woman, so Ellen and I, we would spend a lot of time working on the same staff, not even realizing and not getting the results that we wanted, and she comes from a very corporate background and is highly intelligent and wanted, it had kind of showed me like, hey, what if we did this like this would happen and this would make this easier and I'll be honestIy was a little bit reluctant at first, because I didn't want to, I didn't want to like tarnish the freedom of the tattoo world, and I spent a lot of years like reluctant to really to really change to not tarnish you know, what we had in tattooing which is very special and very much like, you know, fuck you, I do what I want, and I started to see that the industry was changing and if we didn't evolve and modernize and get systems that we weren't going be successful. So I guess once I got on board with that, you know, I brought ideas to the table. Ellen would bring ideas to the table and collectively we would come up with these ideas well, let's do this, what make this easier so I guess one of the first systems that we, that we did was we brought in a electronic sign in forms, so we cut out paper, we don't use paper in the sign in process and not only so it sounds like a thing like, okay well, big deal you don't use paper but this created a whole different way for us to market, so by using an electronic form, so customers would come in, they would sign in an iPad, they have to put their email in, they have to put their phone number, they have to sign up for a mailing list so now we have a mailing list we have a database full of clients that we can tap into at any time, you know, to promote too, and I guess it was at that point, that like a light bulb kind of went off the layer. Oh shit we actually have something here.

Jim: So a lot of people that you are coming to see you anyways, and they're loving what you're doing and the tattoos that you're putting out our incredible, because that's what David and Liz are doing, and they're the top at that, they're the best, so and now you're building a team around them and you and Ellen are working together as a team to grow this brand and now you have this list that's in your ecosystem and not only are they so stoked on the tattoo they just got but now you're delivering value and everything else to that the repeat customers.

Cookie: Totally. And so, and it just evolved from there. like, what once we realize what, like, what we had in our hands, we are like a whole shit, so then it was like, hey, let's make sure every client does a Google review and let's act and beyond that let's make sure every client does a Google review, but let's make sure every client does a five-star Google review and if it's not going to be a five star, Let us know and we'll fix it, what was wrong? What, what could we have done better, you know, and even that it doesn't sound like a system, but it is a system because every time one of our managers checks out a client, you know, they, they finish their tattoo, they go to the front of the studio, okay, that's going to be, whatever it was cost for today, and hey, we'd really appreciate it if you could leave us five-star Google review, and if you didn't have the best experience, you know, feel free to let us why I will make it right? And hammering people for that, I think our Texas Studios have somewhere in the realm of, you know, like, you know, 800 to 1,000 Google like 5 Star Google reviews.

Jim: It's incredible.

Cookie: It's a big deal.

Jim: And especially when you're putting your put, it's not like you're selling a t-shirt, it's not like you're selling a product that someone can rebuy in or you make a mistake and you send them a new one, you're putting a tattoo on somebody that's there forever, so to have that level of review and quality, like, first of all, you're putting out an incredible quality, right, like, are you hire the best people in the industry to come in and work on your team, because that's what you expect.

Cookie: Yep.

Jim: And so, you provide that, so then it comes down to customer service, and which you train your managers, you have that background dealing with people, you understand it and you make sure that everybody that walks through your door as a best experience possible.

Cookie: Yeah, and you have to create that you have to create the experience. The experience won't happen if you just sit back and think like, oh, they like my place that's not going to happen like that so, you know, someone comes in the door, hi, you know, stand up eye contact, all those simple things, but they get forgotten, you know, I was in Salt Lake for the last couple of days and I visited a local Studio there, there's a girl sleeping on the fucking couch, an employee, like, it's just crazy to me.

Jim: And I just want to make sure that this wasn't yours, this wasn't no, no, no, this is a different Studio walked into.

Cookie: Yeah, no, this is I'm not going to name names, I call anyone out, you know, but yeah, this was a studio, nothing related to us whatsoever I just, you know, went to visit a friend there, there's an employee's asleep on the couch, like, this is crazy.

Jim: I've known you for like 10 years, right? Probably give or take. Ten years ago, you probably would have picked that employee up and thrown out the door and said, don't come back, so not, how would you handle that now?

Cookie: I'm very patient, I feel like I've gained a lot of patience. Yeah, you know what, I feel like now, it wouldn't get to that point, honestly, because I feel like we are hiring processes, it's a process will get tattoo artist at a very surprised that we have a two step interview process because they're expecting to shoot an email or DM on Instagram, ask for a job on their hired and it doesn't work like that with us. We go through a two-step normally two interviews.

Jim: Which is why you have the level of reviews and everything else that you do.

Cookie: Yeah, but it but it's funny that you say, back in the day because I was five, back in the day, you know what it is, I don't take it personally anymore. Yeah, you can't at all, the stuff that used to keep me awake at night, this doesn't happen anymore.

Jim: So we talked about starting a small, we talked about systems and scaling, you know, tell the Remote Start Nation cookie, if there's one thing that, you know, from the start to now and even in the future of continuing to grow and scale, what's one thing that you can tell the share with them that has helped you to achieve success, and it might even be something that like, you know, you weren't good at before your continue to get good at it and you want to continue to grow and you know, what would that be?

Cookie: You know what? I think it changes over time it like, my definition of success has evolved, I want to say in the beginning like it was more just the fact that I didn't want to be told what to do so I didn't want to work for anybody else. Now I want to help people, I get a kick out of helping somebody, I get a kick out of seeing our crew, like, you know, maybe they qualify for their first home or they can afford to start a family or their credit is good enough to buy a car, that's kind of like to me that's what draws me these days back in the day I so, my parents divorced, when I was about nine years old and they're on great terms these days but back, then that was a rough time for us, you know, and when it was me and my mom, and she lived paycheck to pay check and tried to make sure I had a great life and I felt that pressure as a kid and it  instilled something in me to wear, like I never wanted to feel that again, I never wanted to be broke, I never wanted to have money, I wanted to be rich, I didn't want to live paycheck to paycheck and but I just didn't know how to do it, so you kind of go from being better to all right, I'm going to get this for myself to like, okay, well, this is kind of cool that like this is In a difference to like fuck, now, just want to help other people, you know.

Jim: You think that had to change it all when you had your first child.

Cookie: Yes.That was a, that was a crazy thing.

Jim: Everything changes, doesn't it? Everything perspective, everything.

Cookie: Yeah, and people tell you it's going to change and I feel like I live every day to the max, you know, like I like to have a good time, I like to work hard play hard. Having my daughter, you know the first child, it was it was a thing that everyone said I was always like well, I'm going to wait till the right time, you know, I when it's the perfect time, we'll have a kid.

Jim: And but when those people.

Cookie: Yeah, it's a funny thing because everyone says there's no perfect time just do it, I might not know, there's a perfect time, like, in life age financially I've got this covered like I know everything, you know, and then she arrived and I was like, fuck, I wish I would have had a ten years ago, she's incredible. There is no perfect time and there's no perfect time to start a business or, or make a change in your own life, you know, that's the reality of it.

Jim: So let's talk, let's talk about, you know, personal qualities and qualities of, you know, employees and even Remote Start Nation, you sitting at home or listening in your car growing a business isn't easy we know that building a brand isn't easy, there's certain qualities that take us to another level and Cookie, you've been able to grow to an awesome level and you're just at the start you are just starting to wear your level is going to be so, you know, one to one topic, you know, I wanted to talk about was laziness and procrastination, and I know that something that really hits home with you and you know me too, like I it's easy, it's easy to procrastinate, it's very easy, and it's easy to wait till last minute to do things but to achieve the level of success that you have like, you can't procrastinate, you can't be lazy, so tell me about that, talk a little bit about that.

Cookie: So, you know, and just so everyone listing those, you know, obviously, you know that there's this podcast today, it's pretty, it's pretty candid, but obviously we talked about some topics, you know, before we got here in the studio to record this and I'd mentioned the Jim that a topic that I want to bring up is laziness and procrastination because I'm, I'm bad about both of those things, I feel like I'm in business because I'm lazy and it's funny because someone had told me that like, years ago, I do this because I'm lazy and I thought it was like the dumbest thing you could ever say because I'm like man, you work harder than anybody and you say you do this because you're lazy, and here I am eating my words like been like, oh shit me too I'm lazy that's why I do this. It's laziness is a funny thing because I'm a very hard worker, and I can also be like the laziest guy in the world if I'm not driven by something and for me personally, I'm the least lazy when I have the most on my plate when I have the pressure on me, I thrive with pressure and to a fault sometimes, you know, like a but I truly feel like the more you put on my plate, the better I perform and laziness is different for everybody, you know, like it could be like, well, you know, I don't want to, I don't want to wash my clothes, I don't want to work out, I don't want to submit these reports to, you know, to the, to the financial team, whatever it is, it's different for everybody and laziness can be broken but procrastination like it's a, it's a killer, the best time to do something in your business, or your company or your solo deal, your entrepreneurship is right now and I really can't stress this enough and I know this from experience because like I said earlier, I'm so bad at both, I will push something to the last minute and just like fly by the seat of my pants, and get it in just on time, but I feel like to have true success you have to grow past that point and push yourself into the uncomfortable, so if you have like a two-week deadline, yes, you could probably knock it out on the 14th day, but why if you're sitting around right now watching cartoons or, you know, smoking weed or doings doing some like unproductive shit, do your deadlines and then enjoy yourself, this is a big thing that I've had to learn and I've had to push through and I work around a lot of people who don't have this issue and when you, when you work around these people who don't have this issue, you kind of feel like an idiot like you like no, man I got to step it up and you know as Jim imagine we have four studios now, we have we're about to get into the to the beauty and Med Spa space and this sort of behavior just doesn't cut it, you know, you have to, you have to step it up and that, that's the biggest piece of advice I could give especially if you're a little newer into, you know, you know, starting your own brand or your own business is, don't wait do it right now, if there's something that needs to be taken care of it, if you own, if you want a clothing brand, you have an order come through at 7 p.m.at night package, that shit up and send it out then, you know, take it to the post office, the next morning because I'll tell you what if that person gets that order, like two three days before they expected their going to be stoked and they're going to support you.

Jim: So, if there's something that you've done to help you overcome you, and I would like laziness is a crazy word, right, like, it could be taken a lot of different ways but like, I would never ever look at you and think that you're lazy, like, you, you know, you called yourself that at one point in and whatever else but like I do, I would never think that, right, procrastination that's a different story,  and I think, That we procrastination is very easy to put it off, and you gave great advice about getting it done now, get it done now, and then do whatever you were going to do before, do it after. So is there, is there something that you started doing to help you improve on that or did you just say, hey I'm going to change for me, it's routine in the morning, and I had to work with a coach to help me to get here, but it was it was sitting down every single morning in a routine planning out my day, every Monday I have a full schedule, where I try to time, block, everything I'm going to do for the week and I start with my most important things first, I never used to do that and what it would do is it would be in my mind and in my mind, and in my mind and I think about it and I go over it, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't act on it, I wasn't being lazy on it, but I wasn't getting the job done and whether that was fear, or whatever, that is the point is, it has to happen now and so, my routine was is today is sitting down and writing it out and time boxing it and then crossing it off, is there something that you did that started to make the change for you?

Cookie: There is, and I guess I'm going to give a little bit of a shout out here, I don't get to listen to the guys much these days, but I was starting to listen to actually a lot of Andy for Cela podcast, you know, and if you're not familiar with Andy, he's the CEO of first form supplements, he's a very talented motivational speaker, and very talented businessman, and he talks a lot about his top five list and it's basically the top five that you need to knock out in a day and I also, you know, he's not the only one that talks about this, you know, a lot of people that are at the top of the game, talk about knocking out the top five and so I made it my goal, I'm pretty good about storing stuff in my head, I'll make less and put calendars notes when I need to, but I'm, I'm pretty, I'm pretty good about having stuff in my head so, so mentally, you know, I here by, you know, when I go to bed at night, I think about my top 5 and I don't write it down on purpose kind of I do this as a thing this works for me and it's whatever works for you to help you with, you know, to stop procrastination and to not be lazy, but for me, you know, I lay down in bed at night and I can't relax until I think about my top five so that might be like, okay, all right, Monday night tomorrow's Tuesday morning, I've got like a 9a.m. artist review, I've got a 10:00 a.m. consulting call, I've got a get banking done by 11, I've got another call at this time, and I'll go through that in my head, so that way I can go to bed, you know, have a restful sleep and I wake up the next day and I can crush those goals and if I crush and by 2 p.m., cool, so at that point, yeah, you could go home but really you've just found an extra three to four hours, you know where you can work on stuff to build your brand more because you did the hard shared all the shit that you didn't want to do. So for me, it's just like, really like recognizing what you have to do and making it a priority and it even prioritizing because You've really got to like break it down, like okay, these are my priorities and but are they are they really like what's going to help grow my business, is this really a priority, you know.

Jim: is it going to move the needle?

Cookie: Exactly. Is this phone call really like worth my time? Because I think when you're younger and business you spend a lot of time playing the part of business and not actually getting business done and I think that's a thing that everybody has and kind of go through.

Jim: When you, when you have a family like you and I do, there's only so many times, so many minutes in the day and you have to prioritize and it took me a long time to figure that out, and I know it's something that is deep in your hiring me to, like it means the world to be able to spend time with my kids, you know, whether that's take my kids, mountain biking, you know, hanging out with daughter, doing whatever it is to be with family and I can't do that unless I move the needle on the other things.

Cookie: Exactly.

Jim: And so you have to move those, you have to do the things first, so don't be lazy, don't procrastinate and it's something that if you're not good at it that's okay, but start getting good at it today, make that make that move. So Cookie, I want to I want to move from, you know, talking about being lazy and procrastinating to You know, back to kind of like managing people, and that's not easy, I remember one of the times I thought, you know that I was on top of the world as a business owners when I had 28 employees, but when it in the end what happened was I was actually the most miserable I've ever been in my life.

Cookie: Yeah. All right, I remember that.

Jim: Yeah, and I think if I would have had better systems and processes in place, maybe it would have been different, I think if I would have said it up to different and, you know, levels of hierarchy within the company to manage and other people manage others, I think it might have been better but I was young and you learn from your mistakes, but I know one thing from that it's you learn so much from managing others and you can take those lessons and continue to grow, you know, throughout, so what's one thing that you can help Remote Start Nation with that, you know, you manage a lot of artists you manage a lot of individual personalities and that's not easy to do, so, throughout the years, what's one thing that you can say that's helped you to be a better manager of people?

Cookie: Totally, yeah, so I used to get so fired up over other people's actions and you can never control what somebody else does, you can only control how you react to any given situation, so, you know, I've by nature, I have kind of a If you use, you know, and it's something that I've tried to work on over the years and but I used to get so bent out of shape about what other people would do and you really have to look at, you know, not every situations, the saint, like I call it like, you know, like you're like, you know, you're a point of view or someone else's point of view and or they're like, you know, their point of the field like, Like there aren't one place at the baseball field I'm on different place, it's going to look different, you know, from for both of us and you have to be respectful of that person, when you're managing people, if you don't like respect and understand people, they're not going to give you the respect back.

Jim: So true.

Cookie: And like, listening is a big part of that, like, listen to people's concerns. I see it day-to-day like, you know, I'll go get, you know, you know, go have like a lunch, whatever, you know even a casual lunch, you know, and I'll see a restaurant manager, like blasting this stuff and just like the in the most horrible way and is all you do is create resentment, if you don't understand and respect people, you just create resentment within your company. So I would say really like, listen to people, take their concerns seriously and no one, no one can show you a faults better than your own employees or your own stuff and if you're not willing to take that seriously, you really need to check your own ego and figure out like, you know, it's not it's not a them problem, that's a you problem.

Jim: And a lot of people a lot of businesses in general, you know, we could relate the same topic to your customer and in a lot of businesses I've seen and coached or talked to they have this product that they think is incredible and they just want to throw it down, everybody's throats and get it out there but what they don't do is they don't look at the perspective of the customer, they don't listen to what the customer says, they're not, they're not bringing that in and changing to make the decision for the customer be like, oh, I love that product, that's something I want, and they fail because of that and as managers a lot of times we fail because we, we don't do that, so that's you've started to evolve that in your business and have you seen your business grow, because of that?

Cookie: Definitely, yes. Oh, you know what, we do these days, you know we go get a coffee together and we talk all, we have meetings that are positive with positive outcomes. It's so easy to like want to be a manager and be like do what I say, but it just it doesn't work like that for everybody, so, um, I've noticed that you have to evaluate your person and what their strengths and weaknesses are and what accelerates them to like, do better and be better and be happy, you know, fit figure out that stuff because if you can't figure that out, you just going to be like it, you know, butting heads, that the whole way. Take the time to know your staff and your people and your team and and give them the respect that they deserve, because, you know, without our team, we don't have a, we don't have a business.

Jim: Correct. Is that something you've always had that is it always been like that or is this evolved because of…

Cookie: This has been an evolution, we've had, you know, people live over the years old, people get fired and I went there's been a couple instances that I wish I would have handled better, you know, if I could go back, I would change him because I didn't handle it well, I was, you know, young as a business owner and immature and some aspects and I wish I could go back and change it, but, you know, you don't do that we can just learn and do better in the future, but it's for us it's like creating that company culture is so important that it's a big deal, you know, we all have to check ourselves as owners.

Jim: Yeah, so talk about company culture for a minute. What are some of your values?

Cookie: Yeah. So we have we have two sets of values, the value as a company for all of us is to put out an exceptional product, you know that customers love of to have an to have a great work environment, you know, that's full of like, you know, it's a happy place, that's everyone's positive and uplifting, and to respect that people, you know, it's a respect, our clients to respect that stuff, we want the, we want the culture to feel like if your mom was walking into our studio for the first time, you know, my mom is in her 60s, if she walked in, I would want her to feel comfortable and safe and be like, all right, I'm in good hands and that's, that's what we that's what we push. But we do have a thing that's, you know, that's part one of our core values is owners is ethical profits, and that's very important to us.

Jim: So what do you mean by ethical profit?

Cookie: Okay, so I want to see people succeed as a business owner as an employee, as a contractor artist, whatever you are, whatever it is, you do I truly want to see you succeed, and I've noticed over the years is a lot of businesses out there that only care about the bottom line and the working conditions are shitty, the attitudes of bad, the management's horrible, like the micromanagement, it's just, it's a toxic environment. So we are a business, we do want to make money obviously, but we want the profits that we made to be ethical, meaning, we treat people with respect, we have a great work environment, if the printer is, you know, a printer and a thermal, fax are crucial to a tattoo artist, if that's broken it's replaced within the hour, not within the day, within the hour, you know, that if somebody needs time off for, you know, an emergency or a family situation or for grieving a loved one that's been lost, they get that. Um, and this old it kind of sounds like it's kind of overlapping with like ethical profits and like company culture, but it all does boil down to ethical profits,  so if somebody lost a loved one and they need a week off, take a week off, you know.

Jim: We always say family first, we look at it. It's so true to him and like any didn't you get better results that way like totally stressed, don't be worried about having to come to me and ask me for time off, this or that I like just do it, like and I don't know about you but for us like with our management, it's do whatever you need to do to take care of your family will be here, just make sure you get your job done, you know. So well Cookie, I appreciate you being here so much, man. This has been incredible.

Cookie: love it.

Jim: It's been, it's been fun, I'm excited for the rest of the night, hang out, have a good time.

Cookie: We're in your hometown.

Jim: Yes, right, we're going to celebrate. So yeah, thank you so much for dropping, so much knowledge for the Remote Start Nation. I look forward in the future to having you back on here and continuing to see your success, and yeah, with that said, brother, I thank you, I appreciate it, greatly.

Cookie: Hey, thanks for having me on, man, it's like ride to catch up and yeah, and also, you also says to man, you know, like you've It's cool to say everything grow from Ink addict days to, you know, what you're doing now and Woodward Movement and yeah, it's kill it.

Jim: Thank you, brother. We're both just starting and both young and our business careers, and I'm excited to continue and see it go but before we say goodbye, I want to we let everybody know where they can find you. Where should they go look online.

Cookie: Totally. So I would say first, go to, you know, Instagram ,check out, RebelMuseTattoo. So @rebelmusetattoo and from there, you can find all the shops, you can also check out our website RebelMuseTattoo.com , and my Instagram is TheRealCookstergram, and from there, you'll find links to everything that I'm involved in, you'll see some real shit here and there, so, you know, be prepared, but yeah, I appreciate you guys listening and I hope to be back on again.

Jim: Well, with that Remote Start Nation, I hope you can put everything that cookie said dropping in your life start today, start something now, and from the bottom of my heart, Thank you all for joining us on this journey, as I help you to start your business, grow your brand, and create your desired lifestyle. Now remember, leave a comment, subscribe, share this episode with your community who you think you learn from what you heard here today.

And until next time, go start something start today and go build the lifestyle, you desire by taking action on it now.